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| | Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^ |    |
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KevinConner
Joined : 09 Nov 2007
Posts : 847
 |  Subject: Re: Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^  Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:15 am | |
| | Dicky Galoot wrote: | I could go point-for-point on how they mangled the plot, but that would make for a real tl;dr post. I'll just give a breakdown of the opening scenes
| Spoiler: | | | While Lyra did play war with the other children, this was only made apparent after the books opening scene in the retiring room. For whatever reason, they decided to completely nix Lyra's original intent on being in the retiring, though I do have to give them credit on the curse door monologue; it was entirely fitting with Lyra's character. It is much latter that we find that Lyra's rival playmate Billy Costa has completely replaced the character of Tony Markarios, whose fate plays no small part in Lyra's development.
Then we find Lyra in the retiring room and are quickly introduced to the Master of Jordan College and....Fra Pavel? But wait, isn't Fra Paval an elderly scholar type and minor character, introduced MUCH latter in the book, and whose role is the Magisterium's aleathiometer reader? No, in the movie he has become the archetypal "evil, sniveling yes-man and doer of dirty deeds for the main baddy" character, with predictable and uninteresting behavior throughout the movie. Soon we see it is he, and not the Master who poisons the wine.
And in walks Lord Asriel, played by Daniel Craig, who is quite possibly one of the worst choices of actors to play the part. In the book it is made abundantly clear Asriel is callous, passionate, and powerful man representative of all it means to be a noble. In the movie he is no more remarkable than any of the nameless scholars standing about in the room, even asking Fra Pavel for permission to go through with his presentation. |
The scenes were rushed and underdeveloped. I think if they'd just extended the movie by an hour, they could have give each scene the development and segue they deserved.
I could go on, but I think that's quite enough. |
| Spoiler: | | |
Ok see I didn't hear anything about them changing Pavel's character for the movie. A lot of my friends didn't seem to care about it enough to even mention it.
Daniel Craig being a bad choice? C'mon! This movie had to make some changes to allow for the plot to move in the second movie, a lot like they had to cut out the entire Tom Bombadil from the Lord of the Rings movie. However, these changes are really minor, and it's clear to me that you missed a few elements. Daniel Craig didn't "ask for permission", that line he said was a sarcastic jab at the ministry's inference in everything from large to small.
He would've continued with or without permission.
As for there being very few scenes of character development for Daniel Craig - it's simple time constraints. They made it clear that they will expound on his character in the second movie. I find absolutely no problems with this, because if they had expounded on his character in the first movie, it would've been a swampy, slow moving mess. Swampy, slow moving messes don't get sequels.
While the movie was a bit rushed in spots, it certainly wasn't underdeveloped. Underdeveloped means that the movie jumps from one plot point to another without any connection or explanation. This movie had clear connections and explanations between each plot point. And each plot point had a minimum of 5 minutes of screen time.
Adding an hour to the movie would've been suicide. I pay to see something entertaining, not to sit in a theatre for 3+ hours watching a slow moving Masterpiece Theatre.
The theatrical releases of Lord of the Rings were really pushing the time limit I can sit in a theater. I'm glad they retained the extended cuts to DVD only release because my knees literally cannot take sitting down in theater seats for that length of time. |
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|  | | KevinConner
Joined : 09 Nov 2007
Posts : 847
| | Subject: Re: Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^ Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:24 am | |
| Also, the Author of the books doesn't seem to mind the changes, and he supports them:
http://www.hisdarkmaterials.org/news/the-golden-compass/a-message-from-philip-pullman-to-his-dark-materials-fans
| Quote: | A message from Philip Pullman to His Dark Materials fans
October 11, 2007 17:30 by Ryan den Rooijen
Tagged with The Golden Compass 23 comments
Following up on the stir that Chris Weitz' statement regarding the ending of The Golden Compass has been causing, the book's author Philip Pullman had the following comforting words to say; reminding us that change is not always bad.
The ending makes every kind of narrative sense. The National Theatre production ended the first part plumb in the middle of The Subtle Knife, and nobody minded that because in the only terms that mattered it worked brilliantly. Every film has to make changes to the story that the original book tells - not to change the outcome, but to make it fit the dimensions and the medium of film. I'm very happy with the work the filmmakers have done, and no-one wants this film to succeed more, or believes in it more firmly, than I do.
- Philip Pullman
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| | | | Rody
The Headless Horseman
Joined : 05 Dec 2007
Posts : 1749
Location : A sarcastic comment.
| | | | | Dicky Galoot
Joined : 07 Apr 2007
Posts : 616
Location : Formerly know as The Rabbty Thing
| | Subject: Re: Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^ Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:58 pm | |
| I had little problem with the ending. I just find it odd that it seems they'll be starting the second movie with a climax.
| Spoiler: | | | Asriel is supposed to be imposing, which Daniel Craig is not. I caught the sarcasm in the question, believe me, but it's the fact he asked at all rather than ignoring Fra that I find out of character.
As for character development, I wasn't talking about Asriel. He gets little development in the book either. I was talking about some of the other cast, like Iofur Ranknison and Lee Scorsby and Ma Costa and John Faa and a score of others. Speaking of Lee, was it just me, or did anyone else get a "creepy old pedophile" vibe from his intro meeting with Lyra O_o.
I still maintain a number of scenes were underdeveloped. I cite Lyra's meeting with Lord Faa and the other Gyptians. Though one scene I thought they pulled off magnificently was Lyra's meeting Iorek; even in it's condensed version, it felt true to the book. Iorek comes off a little more emotional, but I think if they had tried to portray him like he is in the book, it would have come out as a stiff performance. |
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| | | | Java/Schtolty
Professor
Age : 20
Joined : 28 Mar 2007
Posts : 855
Location : Arlington, TX
| | Subject: Re: Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^ Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:34 pm | |
| | Maulkin wrote: | | However, the author of The Golden Compass wanted to harm Christianity (even if it hasn't done any harm), so I'm not gonna support anything to do with him by buying a ticket/renting it. |
I seem to have missed this whole debate, but I figured I'd add in my two cents.
First of all, the way I see it, Pullman wasn't looking to harm Christianity at all. In fact, throughout the books, there is absolutely no message that I can remember that says something along the lines of believing in a God being bad. The main point that he was trying to get across was the fact that if you believe something, it should be your own personal belief, and that you shouldn't try to force others to conform to your belief. In the first book, the "bad guy" was the Magesterium, who were only shown as evil because they were attempting to control everything, including what people think and believe. In the later books, the "bad guy" status moves over to a being known as the Authority (more on this in the next paragraph), who is, once again, forcing others to conform to certain beliefs. This says to me that Pullman wasn't arguing against religion at all. He was arguing against the forceful removal of free will.
As for the Authority himself,
| Spoiler: | | | it's important to first understand that in this world that Pullman has created, there are an infinite number of universes, each one somewhat similar to the others, yet at the same time completely different. In one of these universes lives a race of beings who look similar to what we would call angels. Now, it's been a while since I've read the books, but if what I remember is correct, then this is essentially what happened: There was some kind of war going on between these "angels", and when one side finally won, the leader of the winning side set himself up as the Supreme Authority of pretty much everything. Thousands of years go by, and eventually, people forget that he was simply the victor in an ancient war.
It's at roughly this point in time that the events of the books come into play. As Lyra travels between worlds, she meets people who know the true nature of the Authority, and wish to end his tyrannical rule so as to allow everyone to be free to make their own choices. Once again, that is the true message of the book. Fighting against those who would seek to rule others, in an attempt to allow free will to reign supreme. |
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| | | | KevinConner
Joined : 09 Nov 2007
Posts : 847
| | Subject: Re: Golden Compass rocks ^_^ -_^ ^_^ Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:20 pm | |
| You are correct, sir.
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